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Help with 6.5 rifle choice

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Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« on: October 19, 2016, 03:10:48 PM »
 

montigre

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Cross posting from other forum: I am looking into getting into longer-range rifle competitions. I have an AR that I can "push" out to 300 yards if the weather is nice, I'm shooting on the 3rd Tuesday, and the planets are all in alignment, but would like something that can be somewhat competitive between 300-500 yards. This is the distance I will likely be spending much of my time over the next couple to few years while I learn more about distance ballistics, wind/weather effects, and my own shooting quirks under the pressures of competition.

So, with this in mind, I'm not going to need a $5000-7000 custom rifle until I can consistently nail a solid group at 300-500 yards. I already have a 20x Redfield 3200 scope, so would like to spend <$1500 on an entry-level rifle that is chambered in 6.5CM. I do need a rifle that has an adjustable butt stock as I have very long arms with broad shoulders and the standard hunting-style stock does not allow enough LOP for me. What would be some solid recommendations that would allow a newb to learn the game without too many mechanical issues??  8)
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2016, 04:07:32 PM »
 

Jeff M

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In that price range, for those requirements, I think a rubber precision rifle would probably meet your needs.


That said, what kind of ar do you have that you can't shoot to 500? I have a 223 that will ring steel without an issue at 600.
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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2016, 06:41:07 PM »
 

fatboy

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Jeff who makes this rubber precision rifle? Ah I bet its a Trojan! Just kidding, Im sure Jeff Meant a Ruger Precision Rifle,and i agree it would be a good place to start if you can find one.

 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2016, 07:35:07 PM »
 

ewheuser

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I have a Ruger Precision Rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor.  Factory setup, with a decent scope on it. I do like the rifle, but Ive found some things I dont like about it. That being said, it got me into competitions that I wouldn't have done, and Ive had a blast at the ones Ive been involved with. If you are looking for a rifle to get you into the game, knowing you will upgrade, then its a good choice.

Id be glad to give you some more feedback it you want it.

Either way, buy something and get out and shoot some competitions. You will meet great people, gain some experience, and learn what you might need to change in your setup.

Eric
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2016, 08:00:47 PM »
 

Jeff M

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Jeff who makes this rubber precision rifle? Ah I bet its a Trojan! Just kidding, Im sure Jeff Meant a Ruger Precision Rifle,and i agree it would be a good place to start if you can find one.

Lol!  Damned autoincorrect
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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2016, 05:58:43 AM »
 

DenverDave

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If your looking to get a new rifle the RPR is what I would suggest.  I shoot it out to 1k yards most Saturday's and am confident that it can go a bit further.  That being said, what length barrel is on your AR? Is it 5.56/.223? Accurate rifle? I shoot my ARs out to 500yrds -600 yards regularly and can push them out to 700 in the right conditions .  Not as easy a cartridge (relatively to the CM) to shoot at that distance but a good one to learn on (and cheaper) 300-500 yards is well within that cartridges capacity. Learning on your AR You will get a grasp drop and of reading the wind: essential skill for shooting such a light projectile, that will serve you well as you advance as a LR shooter. I would also suggest looking into a more modern scope with "tactical " features: FFP, Mil- dot type reticle w/ matching turrets. 30mm+ tube so you have adequate elevation to work with.  Good luck!


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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2016, 05:14:07 PM »
 

montigre

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In that price range, for those requirements, I think a rubber precision rifle would probably meet your needs.

That said, what kind of ar do you have that you can't shoot to 500? I have a 223 that will ring steel without an issue at 600.

I have actually been trying to find a rubber---err Ruger Precision, but no one seems to have one.  Also checked out the Savage 110 BA Stealth, but something about it just did not feel right.

The AR I currently have is a Colt 6920.  Yes, it will hit a gong at 500, but not that little 10 point dot without first infusing it with  phase inhibitor, which I believe is still illegal for competitions. 

My shop is suggesting I hold out for a Bergara (it's been back ordered for nearly a year).  I've read the stats and it looks like a very nice rifle, but I am wondering if it is going too much over my head for being the distance newb that I am.  I mean, what if I do not like playing the game--then I have a $2500 rifle + optics that will be sitting in the corner collecting dust when I could have still been out shooting a solidly built novice rifle at half that price point and using the extra cash for ammo.  If I do like the game, I'd have a much better idea of what I would need in a custom or semi-custom rifle based on my personal experiences, instead of pulling at straws like I am now.... 
 

Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2016, 05:51:20 PM »
 

DenverDave

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In that price range, for those requirements, I think a rubber precision rifle would probably meet your needs.

That said, what kind of ar do you have that you can't shoot to 500? I have a 223 that will ring steel without an issue at 600.

I have actually been trying to find a rubber---err Ruger Precision, but no one seems to have one.  Also checked out the Savage 110 BA Stealth, but something about it just did not feel right.

The AR I currently have is a Colt 6920.  Yes, it will hit a gong at 500, but not that little 10 point dot without first infusing it with  phase inhibitor, which I believe is still illegal for competitions. 

My shop is suggesting I hold out for a Bergara (it's been back ordered for nearly a year).  I've read the stats and it looks like a very nice rifle, but I am wondering if it is going too much over my head for being the distance newb that I am.  I mean, what if I do not like playing the game--then I have a $2500 rifle + optics that will be sitting in the corner collecting dust when I could have still been out shooting a solidly built novice rifle at half that price point and using the extra cash for ammo.  If I do like the game, I'd have a much better idea of what I would need in a custom or semi-custom rifle based on my personal experiences, instead of pulling at straws like I am now....

The Bergara looks really nice. I have the XLR Element chassis which they use in there base long range, chassis model. It's a great piece of equipment.

My buddy just got a RPR off GunBroker a couple weeks ago. The inventory goes fast but it seems like more RPRs appear every week. If you go with the RPR I would suggest getting the model 18008 or "Enhanced" version. It's basically the gen 2, comes with a muzzle brake, slimmer handguard and a few other upgrades.  Street price is basically the same as the older model. Personally I would go with the Ruger and put the $500+ you will save over the Bergara into a nice scope.  With long range shooting your rifle is only as good as your glass.  I run a Burris XTR II  4-20. Has all the desirable features for distance shooting at just over $1k... i have had this scope for a few years, now they offer a 5-25x with the SCR reticle, I would suggest going with this model.  LaRue offers it bundled with one of there mounts for a pretty good price. Should you go with the RPR that's the optics/mount combo I recommend.


As for the investment and risk.... the good news is both the RPR and Bergara are very popular guns. Should you decide you don't like long range shooting (doubtful outcome IMO) you won't have any trouble selling either gun for a small loss. Especially the RPR as the Bergara is not as well known. Same thing for the glass. Secondly market for scopes is very active.

FYI- I just found a couple of Bergara LRPs for sale on GunBroker: $1,900-$2000. No RPRs for sale in the buy-it-now format, at the moment, only auctions.... If I was you I would check GB everyday. You should be able to find a RPR for less than 1.4k in about a week. That's how long it took my buddy to find his.

Good luck!  I don't think you will regret this decision.

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« Last Edit: October 20, 2016, 06:07:12 PM by DenverDave »
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2016, 10:19:35 PM »
 

Jeff M

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In that price range, for those requirements, I think a rubber precision rifle would probably meet your needs.

That said, what kind of ar do you have that you can't shoot to 500? I have a 223 that will ring steel without an issue at 600.

I have actually been trying to find a rubber---err Ruger Precision, but no one seems to have one.  Also checked out the Savage 110 BA Stealth, but something about it just did not feel right.

The AR I currently have is a Colt 6920.  Yes, it will hit a gong at 500, but not that little 10 point dot without first infusing it with  phase inhibitor, which I believe is still illegal for competitions. 

My shop is suggesting I hold out for a Bergara (it's been back ordered for nearly a year).  I've read the stats and it looks like a very nice rifle, but I am wondering if it is going too much over my head for being the distance newb that I am.  I mean, what if I do not like playing the game--then I have a $2500 rifle + optics that will be sitting in the corner collecting dust when I could have still been out shooting a solidly built novice rifle at half that price point and using the extra cash for ammo.  If I do like the game, I'd have a much better idea of what I would need in a custom or semi-custom rifle based on my personal experiences, instead of pulling at straws like I am now....

Precisely.  I do not recommend that anyone just run right out and build a custom if they haven't played the game before.  There is SO much more to it than just shooting.  You have to worry about the clock nipping at your ass, you have to worry about the odd positions, the gear (or restrictions, in some cases), the mental portion of it - possibly dumping some targets on a stage to save time and get points on a sure thing.  It's not like going to the range where you just show up and shoot.  I know one guy in particular that can put up 1/4 minute groups prone in his yard at 300, but then when he goes to a match he's consistently in the bottom 1/3 of the field.  I don't want to say it's "tough", per se, but it's definitely not for everyone.

With the demand for the rpr, find one, even a used one, and buy it.  Whether you sell it because you don't like the game, or because you want to upgrade to a custom, you won't end up losing much money.  Couple hundred maybe, depending on how good a deal you are able to find one for.

Keep an eye on Gunbroker, too, they show up there from time to time.

Another option, if you have a 700, get a Criterion remage barrel for it, and then drop it into a chassis system.  XLR makes a nice one, and they are very economical.  Add a replacement trigger, and the net cost won't be too far off from an rpr.  Then when you're ready to play, you can just buy an action and have a barrel done, drop it in the XLR, slap on the trigger from the 700, and you're good.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2016, 01:58:32 PM by Jeff M »
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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2016, 06:16:22 PM »
 

TBACRAY

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Call the Bergara guys. They make some really nice rifles without the high price tags. I was next to them on the firing line this weekend at the Texas Firearms Festival. I saw lots of people hitting at 1K for the first time in their lives. They were shooting a 6.5 Creed with one of our 9" 6.5 Ultras on it. Wicked quiet and very accurate.
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2016, 07:54:23 AM »
 

DenverDave

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In that price range, for those requirements, I think a rubber precision rifle would probably meet your needs.

That said, what kind of ar do you have that you can't shoot to 500? I have a 223 that will ring steel without an issue at 600.

I have actually been trying to find a rubber---err Ruger Precision, but no one seems to have one.  Also checked out the Savage 110 BA Stealth, but something about it just did not feel right.

The AR I currently have is a Colt 6920.  Yes, it will hit a gong at 500, but not that little 10 point dot without first infusing it with  phase inhibitor, which I believe is still illegal for competitions. 

My shop is suggesting I hold out for a Bergara (it's been back ordered for nearly a year).  I've read the stats and it looks like a very nice rifle, but I am wondering if it is going too much over my head for being the distance newb that I am.  I mean, what if I do not like playing the game--then I have a $2500 rifle + optics that will be sitting in the corner collecting dust when I could have still been out shooting a solidly built novice rifle at half that price point and using the extra cash for ammo.  If I do like the game, I'd have a much better idea of what I would need in a custom or semi-custom rifle based on my personal experiences, instead of pulling at straws like I am now....

 Another option, if you have a 700, get a Criterion remove barrel for it, and then drop it into a chassis system.  XLR makes a nice one, and they are very economical.  Add a replacement trigger, and the net cost won't be too far off from an rpr.  Then when you're ready to play, you can just buy and action and have a barrel done, drop it in the XLR, slap on the trigger from the 700, and you're good.

Before I shot the RPR, I had wished I had done the above with a 700. Instead I got a Savage model 10 which I dropped into a XLR chassis. Shoots pretty well but I wish I had the upgrade options the 700 has to offer/ a chassis that was inlet for a 700 because of the variety of custom actions that would fit. With my chassis I am stuck with Savage actions. Not the worst thing in the world but I would like more options.

However, after shooting the RPR and seeing all the aftermarket barrels and upgrade parts that are  already available for the platform (especially the timney 2 stage trigger)  I am now a firm believer that the RPR is the way to go.


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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2016, 09:04:10 AM »
 

montigre

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I appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions and have placed a bid on an RPR in 6.5 creedmoor. 

I realize there can be some inherent flaws with a mass-produced rifle I may experience going this route, but it will get me into competitions very inexpensively and once I learn the games and what I actually need and want in a custom or semi custom distance rifle, I will have a couple of years of actual experience under my belt so I can then make an informed decision.  :)
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2016, 01:56:20 PM »
 

Jeff M

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I appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions and have placed a bid on an RPR in 6.5 creedmoor. 

I realize there can be some inherent flaws with a mass-produced rifle I may experience going this route, but it will get me into competitions very inexpensively and once I learn the games and what I actually need and want in a custom or semi custom distance rifle, I will have a couple of years of actual experience under my belt so I can then make an informed decision.  :)

It's been my experience that if you end up liking the game, you won't wait a couple of years to build a custom.


Denverdave - my gripe with the rpr as a "growth" platform is pretty much the same as you found with savage - not much aftermarket support.  Sure, guys like Chad are doing barrels for them, but they aren't any less expensive than a barrel for a 700 clone/custom.  Then there's the lack of chassis options, the lack of aftermarket triggers (I know timney just released one, but are there any others?), and the fact that it's still a factory mass produced action when you're finished.  Thus, my recommendation to buy one and keep it stock, save any money you might sink into upgrades to put towards a build.  They are a great starter platform, and are capable the way they ship - especially at the price point they are selling for.  They just don't grow well due to limited choices for said growth, IMO.
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Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2016, 04:51:33 PM »
 

TBACRAY

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Scope is more important than the rife anyway. For the money the Vortex PST is good. FFP and matched system of Mils or MOA for knobs and reticle your choice.
 

Re: Help with 6.5 rifle choice
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2016, 02:20:31 PM »
 

DenverDave

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I appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions and have placed a bid on an RPR in 6.5 creedmoor. 

I realize there can be some inherent flaws with a mass-produced rifle I may experience going this route, but it will get me into competitions very inexpensively and once I learn the games and what I actually need and want in a custom or semi custom distance rifle, I will have a couple of years of actual experience under my belt so I can then make an informed decision.  :)

It's been my experience that if you end up liking the game, you won't wait a couple of years to build a custom.


Denverdave - my gripe with the rpr as a "growth" platform is pretty much the same as you found with savage - not much aftermarket support.  Sure, guys like Chad are doing barrels for them, but they aren't any less expensive than a barrel for a 700 clone/custom.  Then there's the lack of chassis options, the lack of aftermarket triggers (I know timney just released one, but are there any others?), and the fact that it's still a factory mass produced action when you're finished.  Thus, my recommendation to buy one and keep it stock, save any money you might sink into upgrades to put towards a build.  They are a great starter platform, and are capable the way they ship - especially at the price point they are selling for.  They just don't grow well due to limited choices for said growth, IMO.


I think you have a good point. I would argue that the aftermarket for the RPR will grow rapidly. I have seen a handful of new aftermarket barrel options come to market in just the past few months I have been "following " the RPR. But, I do agree, as a stock gun, for the money it's a winner.

Maybe you can shed a little light on this for me... you mentioned that there are not chassis options. Do you feel that there is a need for that?

I am new to the long range game. Wanted to buy a RPR in May and could not find one. Impatient and prone to instant gratification I came across a Savage model 10T in 6.5CM on sale for $500ish at Cabellas.  Pulled the trigger on that. Shot it once or twice, realized the Accu-Stock had to go (no surprise) and dropped it into a XLR Element. It's taken me some time to get familiar with the platform (first bolt gun), and tinkering with this and that to get it to shoot well (and me to learn how to shoot it).  Now It's a sub MOA rifle with factory ammo. I shoot steel every weekend out to 1k yards. Sometimes, due to my inexperience with wind the 900 and 1k targets get away but I almost always have first shot hits 400-700.

Sorry, kinda went off on a tangent there. Back to the RPR, a couple months after I got my Savage my buddy got a RPR. I shoot with this guy every weekend.  Had a good amount of time behind the RPR. While both my Savage and his RPR shoot about the same the RPR is a clear winner in terms of features and refinement.  I have heard other people talk about replacing the chassis on the RPR, as you have mentioned.  Judging from my experience with the rifle that's the last thing I would think about changing. Any insight would be appreciated.

To the OP: good luck with the auction. If you don't win check back often.  It's worth the wait.


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