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41 F information.

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41 F information.
« on: January 31, 2016, 06:15:01 PM »
 

Rangerwalker71

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1- FOR THE NEXT 180 DAYS THE CURRENT RULES APPLY. NOW WOULD BE A GREAT TIME TO GET YOUR SILENCERS.
2- AFTER 180 DAYS CLEO CERTIFICATION GOES AWAY AND IT BECOMES CLEO NOTIFICATION FOR BOTH TRUSTS AND INDIVIDUALS
3- AFTER 180 DAYS EVERY RESPONSIBLE PERSON ON A TRUST HAS TO GET A BACKGROUND CHECK INCLUDING FINGERPRINTS AND PHOTOGRAPHS.
4- ATF IS EXPLORING ELECTRONIC FINGERPRINTING IN THE NEXT 180 DAYS AND WILL PROVIDE GUIDANCE.IF YOU WANT TO READ THE ENTIRE RULING HERE IS THE LINK.
https://www.atf.gov/file/100896/download

Here is the 41F filing
federalregister.gov/articles/2016/01/15/2016-00192/machineguns-destructive-devices-and-certain-other-firearms-background-checks-for-responsible-persons



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Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2016, 06:37:04 PM »
 

Jeff M

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That's a good ruling if you're an individual.  Going to make things a much bigger pain in the ass for us trust folks.  :(
Every time you make a typo, the errorists win.
 

Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2016, 07:18:54 AM »
 

Rangerwalker71

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Yes sir. In counties where the Chief LEO won't sign off, it takes his power away.
It will make it so all you have to do is notify them, Not get their Signature.

How ever for the trusts it is going to mean more work for now.
I am certain that when we get new leadership in the White House this will change again.
Maybe they will just take suppressors off the NFA list.(Wishful thinking).
RLTW
Steve
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Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2016, 07:49:02 AM »
 

OKJK11

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When did the 180 day clock start?
 

Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2016, 12:35:48 PM »
 

Rangerwalker71

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Official date was Jan 5. So new law takes effect July 5.
SBR's, AI's and Suppressors. The only way to fly.
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Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2016, 09:14:35 AM »
 

Rangerwalker71

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 41P update.
Final Date is 13 July. Get your forms in asap.

It’s been a long couple of years with the fight against ATF 41P; but, as most people now know, the rule was finalized – and got published in the Federal Register this morning (1/15/2016).

ATF 41F will bring many new changes to how this industry works, but here are the main things to keep in mind:
The new rule will go into effect on July 13, 2016

All applications that have been either approved, or are in process on 7/13/2016 will be processed under the existing rules; so, we’ll be pushing hard as we get close to that date to ensure everything gets to the NFA Branch before the change happens.
ATF 41F Was PassedCLEO Certification will no longer be required

Once the new rule goes into effect, CLEO certification will no longer be required for anybody – including individual applications.

Most people prefer using a trust or corporation to register; but, for anybody registering as an individual it may make sense to wait to submit paperwork until AFTER 7/13/2016.
A new Form 5320.23 will be required for all responsible persons

When registering using a trust or corporation, a new Form 5320.23 will be required for EVERY RESPONSIBLE PERSON.  This form will be sent to the NFA Branch as well as to your CLEO with each silencer purchase.

Note that this form will also require a recent passport photo – taken within the preceding 1 year.

As a side note, I suspect we’ll still be talking about what a responsible person is 5 years from now…

We’re already working to ensure this new paperwork will be as simple as possible for our customers.
Fingerprints will be required for Suppressors & other NFA purchases using trusts or corporations

This is definitely going to be the biggest problem for the industry & customers.  As with individual applications, trusts & corporations will now require 2 physical fingerprint cards for every responsible person.
There will be a 2-year exemption after an approval


The way we’re reading the ATF 41F ruling appears to indicate that you won’t need to provide fingerprint cards or a 5320.23 with photos – or even a copy of your trust, if you’ve had any approval within the preceding 2 year period and your trust hasn’t changed.

It will be interesting to see if these applications get fast-tracked by the NFA Branch in some way…
If you register using a trust or corporation, you will NOT be required to notify the NFA Branch of changes after an approval

In the initial ATF 41P proposal, there was a requirement to notify the NFA Branch with a Form 5320.23 every time your responsible persons changed.

Fortunately, the requirement was removed – and there is specifically no requirement to notify the NFA Branch if you add or remove responsible persons after getting an approval.
Conclusion

We’re still working to both understand the implications of this new rule change, as well as to lessen the impacts if possible.  The next step is a sit down meeting with the ATF and the American Suppressor Association – so we’ll see what new information comes from that.

We truly appreciate everybody who has stepped up and submitted comments on behalf of our industry, as well as those who have supported the American Suppressor Association in their fight to lessen the effects of this executive action.

The NFA community is growing, and I suspect politicians won’t be able to ignore us much longer if we continue to band together.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2016, 09:20:05 AM by Rangerwalker71 »
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Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2016, 09:53:32 AM »
 

TargetHitInidcatorSystems

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So if I already have a trust and have several people on the trust with me are they "grandfathered" in or am I going to need to collect all of this information from each individual that is currently on the trust and submit it? I am assuming that if I do use the trust again for another serial number to be added then I will have to get all the fingerprints and photos done anyway correct?

Thanks
Adam
 

Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2016, 10:16:52 AM »
 

isocyanate

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Sounds like you can amend your trust to remove all responsible persons except yourself, submit your form 4 with your prints and pic, after approval, amend trust to add whoever you want. Right?
 

Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2016, 11:40:31 AM »
 

Rangerwalker71

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So if I already have a trust and have several people on the trust with me are they "grandfathered" in or am I going to need to collect all of this information from each individual that is currently on the trust and submit it? I am assuming that if I do use the trust again for another serial number to be added then I will have to get all the fingerprints and photos done anyway correct?

Thanks
Adam


Adam Currently no changes. Any thing in process will be grandfathered in.
Any new Class III items submitted after 13 Jul, will have to have finger Print cards, and pictures for all controlling members of the Trust.
Know you can amend your trust, Submit form 4, then once it is approved put people back on it.

Hope this helps.

feel free to call me at 816-718-9489 if you have any questions.
Thanks
Steve
RLTW
SBR's, AI's and Suppressors. The only way to fly.
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Re: 41 F information.
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2016, 10:58:21 AM »
 

29aholic

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So, after July deadline if I submit a form 4 as an individual I only need to notify the CLEO. Do I still need fingerprint cards and a picture or will that be a thing of the past?
Thanks, I really don't have time to read the whole thing.
Curtis